The Fleets Thread

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  • #4132
    Jack
    Participant

    That’s a good point on the Devil Ray needing a helmsman, and I actually did have it with a helmsman at first before moving it to the Molina. SS O’Brien may be better than her original version here, which might free up 2 points as the Smokepot isn’t going to be used as much. (The idea was that the Mobilis might have to free Matuku from its pin by firing a smokepot, or otherwise use the smokepot to protect Matuku on its way back)

    #4135
    Ben
    Keymaster

    The idea was that the Mobilis might have to free Matuku from its pin by firing a smokepot, or otherwise use the smokepot to protect Matuku on its way back

    That first part isn’t legal the way I’m thinking of it:

    -The smoke (fog bank) cannot be placed under or in contact with any other game piece.

    (Pirate Code)

    #4138
    Jack
    Participant

    Well there goes literally the only reason to use a Smokepot Specialist besides fog hopping.

    Also I guess Smokepot Specialists are 3 points, not the 2 I have on my card soooo

    #4143
    Ben
    Keymaster

    Well there goes literally the only reason to use a Smokepot Specialist besides fog hopping.

    Actually, my favorite usage of them is with the Reverse Captain ability.  Shoot a bunch of cannons at an opponent, reserving the last one for the fog/smoke bank.  Then dart into it to protect yourself from the return fire.  The Muninn and original Grand Temple are good ships to do it with, though there are others that work well.  (some crew with RC of course but they’re pretty much never worth the points)

    Also I guess Smokepot Specialists are 3 points, not the 2 I have on my card soooo

    They are the overcosted one.  At 2 or 1 point they’d be far more intriguing; I find it bizarre that the non-damaging specialist type is the most expensive.

    #4393
    Mechavelli
    Participant

    I’m about to meet some friends for a couple of Pirates matches, so I’ll have a battle report soon! In the meantime, here are the lists I’ll be using today:

    We have both a deathmatch and a standard game planned, both at 40 points.

    Standard fleet: Sun and Moon

    Le Soleil Royal + Captain + Helmsman + Madamoiselle Josephine Godiva

    La Victoire +Captain + Helmsman + Explorer

    Le Coeur du Lion

    Deathmatch fleet: Napoleon’s Chosen

    Le Soleil Royal + Captain + Helmsman + Cannoneer

    La Possession + Captain + Helmsman + Firepot Specialist

    Let me know what you guys think of these fleets! We’ll soon see how the French stack up in a few hours!

    #4394
    Ben
    Keymaster

    I’m about to meet some friends for a couple of Pirates matches, so I’ll have a battle report soon!

    Awesome!  Both fleets look good!

    #4399
    Mechavelli
    Participant

    Well, we didn’t get around to playing the standard or finishing the deathmatch, but I’m proud to say that my French deathmatch fleet fought like an enraged adder!

    My opponents were three: player 1 had the HMS Grand Temple and Raninoidea, Player 2 had another Temple and Brachyura or however you spell that, and Player 3 had two OE Acorazados with Calico Cat on both of them. We let him break the no duplicates rule and I think I’ll be fine letting it slide since OE Acorazado isn’t a big deal to get up in arms over.

    You guys might be surprised to know that Player 1 got knocked out first. He unfortunately had no captain on his Titan, so he got it too close to Player 2’s fleet and it blew up in the next turn. His Temple fell prey to my Possession’s firepot and the Soleil Royal’s mighty guns, clearing him from the game.

    Player 3 was nearly wiped out next, with the Possession cleaving one Acorazado and leaving it mastless along with a helpful ram from the Soleil. The Soleil, in turn, blasted 3 masts from the second Acorazado and sent it limping back home. We were playing with whirlpools and the derelict Acorazado had an oarsman and a helmsman, so both just barely had enough gas in the tank to teleport back home.

    My ships were left with the Possession with two masts, and the Soleil Royal was left with three. Overall not a bad trade, but we’ll never know who would have won that match since we all got distracted and did something else instead of ending it haha.

    #4401
    Ben
    Keymaster

    My ships were left with the Possession with two masts, and the Soleil Royal was left with three.

    Nice, sounds like you had the best crew setups overall.  In my experience it can take a while for players to learn that helmsmen and captains are incredibly essential, especially having both on just about every gunship.

    #4413
    Mechavelli
    Participant

    Player 3 was relying on his Calico Cats getting double actions so he could move and shoot, but I think having a captain is far superior in that situation.

    It’s sometimes bothersome to have to ration out 5 points for every gunship, but it’s very necessary! Moving fast and shooting with one action is a great deal and forms the bread and butter of my battle strategies.

    #4414
    Ben
    Keymaster

    Player 3 was relying on his Calico Cats getting double actions so he could move and shoot, but I think having a captain is far superior in that situation.

    Definitely, and ideally you’d have both.

    It’s sometimes bothersome to have to ration out 5 points for every gunship, but it’s very necessary! Moving fast and shooting with one action is a great deal and forms the bread and butter of my battle strategies.

    Exactly.  It can seem weird to budget 5 additional points for every gunship (considering 3 gunships in a fleet=15 points of crew, which could be spent getting another gunship), but it’s pretty much always worth it.  Crew are often the lifeblood of effective fleets.

    #5030
    jetmoto-1996
    Participant

    Hi All!

    Does anybody ever try to run a Viking Fleet from time to time?  I have had limited success when based around Munnin.  Just curious what you guys have found success doing (if anything considering the difficulty of sailing as the Vikings!)

    My last fleet i used for them was this:
    Fleet: 70 Point Game

    Munnin: – Reverse Captain (30 Points)
    18 Points
    3 Cargo
    S+S Move
    Crew:
    Sigurd Anderson – 6 Points
    Smokepot Specialist – 3 Points (could sub with musketeer)
    Captain – 3 Points

    Wiglaf: +1 vs Cursed (18 Points)
    13 Points
    4 Cargo
    L Move
    Crew:
    Oarsman – 1 point (no cargo)
    Ethan the Farseeker – 4 points (no cargo)

    Yggdrasil: Once per turn when this ship hits an enemy ship, also eliminate one crew from that ship. (20 Points)
    12 Points
    2 Cargo
    L Move
    Crew:
    Shipwright – 2 Points
    Olof Linstrom – 6 Points

    I have the unfortunate issue of never getting my hands on a viking helmsman.  But if the Dice are good to me Sigurd can kind of fill in where needed.  I essentially try to get Munnin out at striking distance and wait for a good roll with Sigurd while the Wiglaf slowly collects treasure.  The Yggdrasil sort of fills in where needed, usually defending an island and trying to dissuade treasure hunters because even one hit could take away one of their crew!

    It has worked about 50-50.  It really relies on the Munnin taking down a gun ship off the go!

    I would welcome any advice!

    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by jetmoto-1996.
    #5036
    Ben
    Keymaster

    Does anybody ever try to run a Viking Fleet from time to time?

    Not often, but sometimes in less competitive games.  Sometimes I like to combine them with other factions, including a minor faction alliance like the one used in this crazy game.  I am playing them as a single faction in both CG4 and THC so we’ll see how that goes in the long run.

    Ethan the Farseeker – 4 points (no cargo)

    He links to all Viking ships, which does not have the same effect as taking up no cargo space.  That’s important because if he didn’t take up cargo space, that specific ability wouldn’t stack with the Oarsman.

    I think the fleet would struggle quite a lot with no helmsmen.  All 3 ships really need one to stay competitive.  A good rule of thumb is that ships with less than S+L base move generally need a helmsman to stay competitive in most games.  Of course that depends on the opposition – if they’re not using helmsmen either, speed becomes less important.  I will say I’ve had some success with Muninn, and you could make a case that she’s their best gunship.

    I actually suggest do a combination of things to alleviate the lack of generic crew problem – let generics use their abilities on ships of any nationality, and even make/print paper crew chips that say “Helmsman” for use as proxies. (such as found on this page)  Wizkids never got the generic crew distribution right, so I don’t like when random pack draws determine someone’s competitive play standing in the game.

    #5037
    jetmoto-1996
    Participant

    I am playing them as a single faction in both CG4 and THC so we’ll see how that goes in the long run.

    Ill have to pay attention to how that goes for you! I agree they are best for a mixed nation fleet. But every now and then it is fun to use them as a full nation.

    He links to all Viking ships, which does not have the same effect as taking up no cargo space. That’s important because if he didn’t take up cargo space, that specific ability wouldn’t stack with the Oarsman.

    Well… My friends and I have been getting that wrong for a LONG time. lol

    I think the fleet would struggle quite a lot with no helmsmen.

    You are certainly right and its not that i chose to not include them its that we usually play with the rules that if you don’t have a generic crew for any one nation you are out of luck. Which brings me to the point of saying that i really like the house rule of all generic crew can be universally used across fleets. That would especially make minor factions more usable as i don’t have every crew type to any of the minor factions except Jade Rebellion.

    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by jetmoto-1996. Reason: had formatting issues
    #10081
    Ben
    Keymaster

    Back in June 2019 right before the fall of Miniature Trading, I did make the fleets I talked about in my post from March 2nd.  Here they are:

    American Pirates 2
    American Pirates 3
    American Pirates 4
    American Pirates 5
    French Pirates
    Pirate All Stars

    At some point in the future I may write descriptions for the fleets and make them into full posts for the Fleets category.  Feedback welcome of course.

    #11159
    Jack
    Participant

    Not seeing a dedicated fleet thread, so I’m gonna post my latest fleet here and edit with how well it does in a few days after it gets played:

    (Note, I have a habit for liking to not just stick to a single faction, but a single pack at a time if I can help it. This is mostly for aesthetic purposes as the designs of the ships usually look uniform. I also making fleets based around flavor text/lore as you’ll see.)

    Fleet: (40/45 pts)

    Snipe, 10 pts

    – Captain Jack Hawkins

    Zephyr, 8 pts

    – Calico Cat (SM)

    Venture, 7 pts

    – Captain

    El Chico, 8 pts

    – Captain

    Longshanks, 12 pts

    – El Fantasma (SM)

    – Helmsman

    – The Hag of Tortuga (CC)

    The Devil’s Maw

    The idea is half aesthetic half strategic. I want a fleet that feels like a ragtag team of pirates instead of a couple super strong ones. Three of the four “main characters” of the franchise show up, with Jack and Cat captaining the ships that are supposed to be their first. I want this to be like the pirates first starting their careers.

    The strategy is a bit based on surprise. At first it might look like a “mosquito” type fleet that tries to spread out and snipe the best coins from each island, but it’s actually quite aggressive. The fleet wants to hit the enemy on their way back from the islands, laden with treasure. Much like an actual pirate fleet! Zephyr/El Chico and Snipe/Venture will tag team attacks, with the sloops ramming target ships and taking out crew, with the brigs coming after to finish them off. (The Snipe may be able to handle a ship on her own if it’s a 2/3 master with all L guns.) I’m worried I’m wasting Longshanks’s potential in this fleet, but we’ll see. I think it will do really well against fleets composed of 2 moderately expensive ships, but El Acorazado looms.

    #11162
    Ben
    Keymaster

    Not seeing a dedicated fleet thread

    Maybe it was on the second page of the forum before I moved your post, but it’s still here!

    I want a fleet that feels like a ragtag team of pirates instead of a couple super strong ones. Three of the four “main characters” of the franchise show up, with Jack and Cat captaining the ships that are supposed to be their first. I want this to be like the pirates first starting their careers.

    Love this idea!  I’m a little surprised I don’t think I’ve seen a fleet just like this one.  The theme is great.

    I think it might be a little too weak to be combat-oriented.  Ramming could work well, but the fleet isn’t too strong with boarding since most of the ships have less than 3 masts.  I would prefer a captain on the Longshanks over Fantasma, especially since he only has room for 1 coin and the LS is both the fastest and most powerful ship in the fleet here.

    #11168
    Jack
    Participant

    Yeah I’m not too happy with Longshanks but love the rest. I really wanted to add Fantasma in this fleet for thematic purposes and Longshanks was the best fit of Spanish Main pirate ships that were low enough points for me to add without going over. Another captain would be better, objectively. What I might do is move Hag over to Venture (which gives an added bonus of her not being capturable) which allows an extra spot on LS for cargo. Bloody Jewel from Pirates of the Revolution would be perfect if I was allowing pack mixing, and I honestly still might do it since that ship matches the Fantasma aesthetic real well.

    #11172
    Ben
    Keymaster

    What I might do is move Hag over to Venture (which gives an added bonus of her not being capturable)…

    I know I’m being nitpicky, but someone could still nab her using a Gold Capture crew like Bonny Peel.  🙂

    Bloody Jewel from Pirates of the Revolution would be perfect if I was allowing pack mixing, and I honestly still might do it since that ship matches the Fantasma aesthetic real well.

    The temptation to break restrictions to optimize a Pirate fleet using their underpriced or OP stuff is almost always present.  I think it’s a shame sometimes because people might come along sometimes and say “just swap out the Zephyr for the Banshee’s Cry”, even though using the Zephyr is more unique and the BC is almost a meme of this game.

    #11310
    Jack
    Participant

    I read @woelf’s old Asesino de la Nave review and it inspired me to buy it. I’ve long had her pirate version, the Santiago, and my most used ship may be France’s La Belle Etoile. But now I want to make a fleet dedicated to destroying cargo.

    Panda (22 pts)

    Havana Black

    Calico Cat (SM)

    Oarsman

    Helmsman

    Santiago (17 pts)

    Captain

    Helmsman

    Rover (2 pts)

    The Hag of Tortuga

    Banshee’s Cry (3 pts)

    Divers (1 point)

    Dead Man’s Point

    Simple enough strategy, I suppose. Very similar to how I use my La Belle Etoile fleets. Panda and Santiago head to an opponent’s HI. If they have time to stop at a wild island near it to load some gold, they can. Otherwise their job is to blockade the HI and intercept returning runners. Undercosted OP pirate boats do their thing, with Banshee’s Cry collecting the nearest island’s gold and Rover being our fort builder.

    #11311
    Ben
    Keymaster

    @Jack: Solid early-set fleet.  I just don’t like the Santiago in general.  I’m seeing her at 11 points so you should have 1 more point.  I also don’t normally put multiple action generators on the same ship, though it makes a bit of sense here since Havana Black doesn’t have many crew to sac.  With the extra point available you could add an oarsman to the Panda and put Calico cat on the Santiago.

    If you want a “mega”/maximized version of cargo wrecking, check out my fleet Crew Recycling 2.0.

    #11408
    Jack
    Participant

    A couple of 80 point Crimson-ish Coast fleets that may go up against each other soon:

    France:

    La Ville de Paris

    – Capitane Gastone de St. Croix

    – Madame LaFontaine

    – Captain

    – Helmsman

    – Cannoneer

    L’Orient

    – Capitane Arathiel

    – Helmsman

    – Oarsman

    – Oarsman

    L’Auguste

    – Explorer

    – Maurice Artiside

    L’Artesien

    – Monsieur LeNoir

    – Vicomtesse Richelieu

    UTs: Buried Treasure, Plunder

    I originally had one less Oarsman and La Magnifique, but I use Magnifique in almost every French fleet that can fit her, so I’m giving my new purchase Ville de Paris a shot. L’Artesien can attempt a rum bomb trick with the UTs if it gets lucky. Filching Gold really isn’t that strong. I almost put the Vicomtesse on La Mercure so she could use her ability without her ship getting pinned but I like her being on her lore correct ship with her link for thematic reasons.

    Pirates:

    Deliverance

    – Calico Cat (OE)

    – Bonny Peel

    – Lady Baptiste

    – Shipwright

    Santiago

    – Havana Black

    – Bloody Jake

    – Gaspar Zuan

    – Helmsman

    – Cannoneer

    – Oarsman

    – Oarsman

    Amity

    – Explorer

    Rover

    Girl power drives the Deliverance, though I’d have to proxy Lady Baptiste as I don’t own her. Cat and her canonical protogé are on a very not canon ship for them. Havana Black and Bloody Jake seem like a perfect thematic fit for the Santiago, which I believe is the captured pirate version of the Asesino de la Nave.

    #11414
    Ben
    Keymaster

    The fleet above is why I’m happy to see posts to this thread.  I don’t know if I’ve ever put anything other than a helmsman and maybe an oarsman on the Artesien.  That linked combo is very cool because it fills out the ship’s point cap space while still saving room for 3 open cargo spaces.  The cancelling is a great thing to have on a gold runner for deterrence.  I’m used to “power gaming” setups with great gold runners like the Artesien, so I’m glad you came up with a more creative way to crew her.

    Nice use of Gaspar Zuan on the Santiago, but it looks like that ship is one over on cargo space.  I’m seeing 5 total spaces but 6 crew that take up a space since the second oarsman doesn’t stack.  I would probably drop the cannoneer and maybe even add helmsmen to the Amity and Deliverance (swapping out the shipwright on the latter).

    #11417
    Jack
    Participant

    For some reason I only ever made one fleet post on MT despite 5-6 ship reviews. I’m making up for lost time with this thread lol.

     

    Whoops, forgot that second Oarsman would count as cargo. I really want to keep that cannoneer because of Santiago’s rank-4s so I might just change Amity’s explorer into a helmsman. Not sure though.

    #11671
    Bartek
    Participant

    Well, my favourite combat fleet of El Fantasma for 80 pointa from the Cursed is this:

    Divine Dragon with El Fantasma, helmsman and action fodder (oarsmen), but since I lately aquired Sir Edward, he could come in handy.

    Executioner with captain,

    Hellfire with captain and helmsman ( I seriously think this ship was heavily underrated)

    Behemoth (Everybody gangsta, until a giant kraken appears from under the waves. And shoots).

    Also, for a lighter approach I like Juggernaught, with captain and helmsman. Because I like  4 master schooners.

     

    Also I’m tempted for a serpent’s fang with hag of tortuga, Behemoth, Calim and mist walker. That’s 5 L movement. Tempting.  But I lack the longboat and Hag  🙁

    • This reply was modified 2 months, 2 weeks ago by Bartek.
    #11676
    Jack
    Participant

    Ayyyy more fleets thread posts.

    I agree that the Hellfire is underrated. Very solid fighter. The behemoth is also really strong in games like this.

    What could you do with Tabitha McWarren (DJC) on the Divine Dragon? You only have room for one oarsman right now, and I feel it may be stronger to load up on crew on your flagship instead of having the executioner. Maybe something like El Fantasma, helmsman, a couple oarsmen, Tabitha McWarren, Calico Cat (OE)

    #11677
    Ben
    Keymaster

    I assume that’s more of a deathmatch fleet?

    A simple Divine Dragon setup with Fantasma, helmsman, and 3 oarsmen (or 4 since Fantasma links) should do well.  Hellfire is a solid “stock” or “numbers” gunship.  I love the Juggernaut actually, I think she is possibly more underrated than Hellfire.

    RotF Hag wouldn’t stack on the Serpent’s Fang since the abilities are the same.

    #11681
    Bartek
    Participant

    Forgot about the stacking.

    Yes, this is more of a  death match fleet, Cursed are not for gathering gold, unfortunately.

    With 4 cargo Divine Dragon can carry linked El Fantasma, helmsman, sir Edward and 2x oarsmen.

    While tempting, I didn’t put OE Davy Jones, because I wanted the fleet to be as much of El Fantasma’s as possible.

    Thanks for feedback guys 🙂

    #11686
    Ben
    Keymaster

    With 4 cargo Divine Dragon can carry linked El Fantasma, helmsman, sir Edward and 2x oarsmen.

    The link makes 5 spaces.  4 of those crew take up space, leaving one still open.

    Who is “sir Edward”?  I thought you were talking about Sir Edmund from F&S.  Why would you need a reducer crew if you’re not even close to being over on points?

    The Divine Dragon is actually my favorite ship to use him on normally, but that’s with OE Davy Jones + captain and helmsman.

    #11688
    Bartek
    Participant

    Good point. Yes, that’s sir Edward from F&S. I overthink it some times, the cost reducer is a bit too much here.

    But with Davy Jones, Captain and helmsman, yes, I like the idea.

    I wonder, did someone actually made a Cursed fleet with 2 – 3 sea monsters, for 80 points, that’s actually playable?

    And not only Behemoth or Tsuro as “distraction targets”.

    #11689
    Ben
    Keymaster

    Yes, that’s sir Edward from F&S.

    But that’s the problem and where my confusion comes from.  The name of the crew is Sir Edmund, not “sir Edward”.

    I wonder, did someone actually made a Cursed fleet with 2 – 3 sea monsters, for 80 points, that’s actually playable?

    Not that I recall offhand, though it’s probably been done.  I like using them at 150 though.

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