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I never know how to judge fleets that aren’t 40 pts because I’ve not played many games other than the standard 40 pt one. But HMS Oxford is one of England’s best ships, and Aberdeen Baron of course is a fantastic gold runner.
As the Carrion Crew is not English, (and also 4, not 5 pts) you can make it a pure England fleet with HMS Cumberland. I also like the HMS Snipe a lot at 8 points.
Oh yeah I imagine something like Econ edition would make her a bit more useful, being able to dart across big islands or lines of reefs to transport something safely.
Well I went ahead and bought Le Loup-Garou anyway. (Saw it for 50 cents so why not?)
Here’s a fail-tastic “fleet” that, for some reason, tries to invest everything into LLG:
Le Bon Marin (6 pts)
Le Loup-Garou (34 pts)
– LeNoir (F&S 4 pt version)
– Benoit de Marseilles
– Michel de Bordeaux
The two Marines did well on board Le Favori in a similar concept. Le Favori’s speed and L-range immunity allowed it to be a platform for the marines to shoot safely. This fleet just goes all in on that gimmick. The weakness of the Favori build was boarding. That’s fixed with the Ghost Ship ability. Also, Lenoir will stop captains in their tracks, essentially giving the ship the “can’t be shot at by ships S away from her” ability. It can only be hit by L-range guns more than S-away, which is pretty tricky. Or else you’d need something like a Captain AND an extra action crew.
Is this fleet good? No. Is it going to be fun? I think so!
What luck! Just messaged the guy on reddit.
I just spent twice as much on ebay for some of the things he’s selling -_-
I’m on the hunt for a few items from MI: Mobilis, Eileen O’Brien, HMS Zephyr, and Hermoine Gold. If anyone sees them for ~7.50 at most let me know!
I think that the setup is fair as is, with player 2 picking player 1’s island first. I actually often feel like choosing your opponent’s HI first is more powerful
I typically use Tiger’s Eye with Barbarossa or Hawkins + Skyme when I make an offensive Barbary fleet, which works pretty well. I’ve noticed as well that the best cannons on Corsair ships tend to be the front ones, which makes me think this was on purpose to tie in to boarding. Otherwise yeah I go all into gold running with Corsairs.
I’m not expecting LLG to be competitive for me, but it’s still a nice addition to the collection if only for the flavor of it. I feel like there’s probably some build that can max out its abilities, but you’re right that there’s probably just objectively better ships at 17 points. I mean, La Magnifique is 17 and I think Le Superbe is 16.
Is Ghost Ship worth 6 points? I feel like it should be 2. (SCS El Fantasma would imply that it costs 2 points for him)
So uh Marines aren’t as bad as I thought they were. Maybe.
Did a series of games of France vs Corsairs.
France had Le Favori, La Baionnette, and Le Bon Marin. Their only crew was Benoi de Marseilles and Michel de Bordeaux on Le Favori. Corsairs had Morocco, Whisper, and Tiger’s Eye with a helmsman on Morocco and Barbarossa and a firepot on Tiger’s Eye.
The French fleet won a best of 3 2-1 and the Marines were key in both games. They were far more versatile than I thought they would be, with them allowing Le Favori to blow up two masts from the Tiger’s Eye in game one. In game three the Marines landed on an island Whisper had docked at and blew it up, then defended it until Le Bon Marin could arrive.
The marines also made boarding parties hell for Barbarossa. Even with the L-range protection, the Corsairs were only ever able to get one successful boarding party off. Because getting within S+S+S (in order to board next turn) also means getting within the S+L+S the Favori needed to spring the Marines on them. Also, when Barbarossa was able to get off a firepot, Le Favori’s marines just returned fire without Le Favori being given an action and risking scuttling.
I really like how the French fleet performed. I guess it would probably be better with those 13 points for the Marines being spent on something like La Courageux and a captain but the marines put in a ton of work in getting their wins.
I bought from RainTyger the other day. Let’s see how they do.
Fun fact I apparently ordered something from them when I was 14 and never paid. I tried to sign up and they told me I’d already made an account… then I saw confused messages from them asking if I was gonna pay or if they should cancel my order /facepalm
Which Hermione Gold?
I really want to track down her MI version and do a scenario of her vs Eileen O’Brien
I ordered Silver Dagger, Monsieur LeNoir (CC) and Uluj Ali online.
Silver Dagger is a nostalgia piece, as it was one of my first ships as well as one of the first to break. I love its effect and flavor text. I think the game would have benefited from more effects/mechanics like Dagger’s, it makes the game feel more realistic. Also its flavor text is one of very few references to the Dutch in the game. Still bummed they were never an official nation.
LeNoir being a point more than normal for cancellers is a pain but yay for more French options.
Marines are bad but I’m always after more Barbary Corsair crew and Ali was cheap.
“Barbarossa’s Revenge” – 40 pt. Barbary Corsair fleet
Barbarossa is somewhere in the Atlantic Ocean at the moment, on his way here. I’ve come up with a fleet to play him in when he does get here.
Tiger’s Eye (24 pts)
– Aruj Barbarossa
– Firepot Specialist
Whisper (6 pts)
Morocco (10 pts)
– Helmsman
I keep trying to design fleets without the Tiger’s Eye, and I keep winding up using it anyway. Bah.
Only thing I’m unsure on is how well flotillas will do in deathmatches. My gut says it’s a good idea, but I can’t say for sure, since you’re using La Bonne Chance to tow it and while that’s the fastest French ship around it’s not the most deadly.
You can’t pin an enemy ship with one of your own pieces except Sea Monsters. They can always move away.
(RIP to one of my favorite strategies- Using the Snipe to ram a warship with all L-range guns like USS Constitution.)
Final update re: the long game between Malta and the Corsairs.
The initial rules unfairly favored Malta, however Malta made some pretty bad moves in the first two days that kind of evened things out (like purchasing the all L-range L’Aube when the Corsairs had the immune-from-L-range Tiger’s Eye.) So despite the disadvantage the Corsairs had been hanging in there.
Disaster struck on the third day as everything went wrong for the Corsairs. First They lost the Terror of Gibraltar to a L’Aube early in the day, then a perfectly timed Marine landing took out the Whisper. And finally, the Tiger’s Eye got a bit desperate and tried to take on the HMS Oxford only to miss with all but one gun and for the Oxford to sink it on the next turn.
MVP of the match was probably the HMS Algiers. At one point it was able to carry 6 pieces of cargo at once. (Admiral Blake, Watkins Defoe, First Mate Ismail, and 3 gold coins)
I used to play Ghost Ship accidentally in the “submersible” way and it was just too powerful. So I was glad when I found out I was playing it wrong. I actually think that the effect is balanced as is, but maybe too expensive.
I assume you mean the flotilla, not the blockade runner for Mont Blanc?
Been a while since I’ve done a deathmatch– 12 years, actually– so my advice is probably outdated but I feel like speed is king in them. So the 3S MontBlanc towing a flotilla is a nice move, and Arathiel being able to effectively double your movement speed is also a must. I don’t know what your collection is like, or what the rules here are, but I really like Firepots in Deathmatches.
Also, if you have/can get them, the extra 5 pt guy whose name I’m blanking on + Monsieur LeNoir might be useful here. You can replace 2 Oarsmen to make room, meaning that Arathiel will have less “bait” to SAC but you get a sweet canceller ability in the trade-off.
Oh then I’m not sure which I’d rather. Maybe LSR just because of points.
My favorite French flagship will always be La Magnifique, though there’s plenty of competition.
The loser chooses in almost every scenario. So if he’s got a bunch of crew he can eliminate his oarsman, cannoneer, helmsman, etc. before you get to the best one.
But it’s not once per turn either and in a standard game you don’t tend to see too many crew on a ship.
Le Superbe has been on my wishlist for like 12 years now. I like it more simply because of how beautiful it is. I do think in a standard game LSR is better, though. Shooting through other ships doesn’t come up all that often.
However, there are few more satisfying things than pulling up to a ship like El Acorazado with La Magnifique and getting off a broadsides!
I really do feel like Marines were meant to be stacked. If Woelf’s lurking maybe he can correct me here, but as the only ability that can stack in the game I wonder if Wizkids meant for people to play 2-3 Marines per fleet, like an army to compliment your navy. But their point cost would make even less sense in that case.
The planned matchup against the BC fleet was put on hold for the long game until Barbarossa gets here. However, the Marine did prove useless in that game, as the Tiger’s Eye took it out first try.
I do think Marines can be neat counters to Barbary ships because of how poor Barbary cannons can be, but they’re still way too expensive and like you said, since the Barbary Corsairs can still explore and leave as long as it has 3+ masts or an explorer it won’t be in any real danger. I think they should’ve been able to shoot twice on land, like longships sorta.
I’m gonna use this comment to chronicle the long game I’m playing until my copy of Aruj Barbarossa arrives, with altered rules. I briefly explained how I’m playing it over on the Game Ideas thread, but basically:
– Malta (Spain/England/France) vs Barbary Coast
– Malta has one HI, Barbary Coast has 3.
– 24 turns a day (one per “hour” until Barbarossa arrives. He’s expected between one and two weeks from now.)
– I’ve added a “food” mechanic. Each city has to feed itself. Coins can be spent on food, 2 food per coin. Each HI goes through one food per turn. (Based on how Day 1 went, I think in the future Malta will go through 3 per turn for balance now.)
– 4 wild islands, gold completely random. They replenish at a rate of one coin per turn, with a max of 4 coins per island.
– Malta ships can “blockade” Barbary HIs if they’re within L of it. A blockaded Barbary port that runs out of food becomes captured, and remains under Malta’s control as long as they have a ship within L. Malta wins if all 3 Barbary islands are captured before Aruj Barbarossa arrives to turn the tide. The Corsairs win if at least one island is still under their control when he comes.
Initial fleets:
Malta:
Le Bon Marin, with Khaleed Youssef on board
HMS Algiers, with Sir Watkins Doyle on board
El Duque, with Admiral Alarico Castro and Duque Vaccaro on board
Barbary Pirates:
Tigers Eye, with Jack Hawkins and DJC Skyme the Monkey
Algiers, with an explorer
Whisper
Day 1:
Day 1 started out OK for the Corsairs. Bon Marin ran into the Marines UT, meaning that Youssef was eliminated before he could do any work. However, the Barbary Algiers ran into England’s HMS Algiers, whose effect for an extra action went off twice in a row, allowing it to catch up to and capture its Barbary counterpart right after it loaded up on gold.
Meanwhile, more bad news for the Corsairs: The French enlisted the help of marine Benoit de Marseilles, and placed him at the nearest island to their own islands, really hurting their economy. El Duque sailed over to the island nearest “Tunis,” and established El Castillo Del Infanta. Suddenly, the cash and food strapped Corsairs were down to two wild islands.
However, Jack/Skyme/Tiger’s Eye proved to be a deadly combination. They weren’t able to recover the Algiers, but successfully boarded it and stole all of its gold before Malta could unload it. As the Spanish captured “Tunis,” the Tiger’s Eye was busy eliminating the French marines, freeing up a wild island. Then, thanks to Hawkins’s leadership, it stormed 6S across the sea to board Le Bon Marin and steal all its treasure before it could unload.
The stolen treasure has been enough to keep the other two Barbary HIs afloat, and with El Duque tied up holding down “Tunis,” things are stable for the Barbary Corsair faction. However, Day 2 will be a test. The French have constructed L’Aube, and outfitted her with a superb crew. While the Tiger’s Eye will be able to avoid it, the rest of the fleet is suddenly in big danger. But the recruitment of a Firepot Specialist may be just the sort of trick they need to survive.
Fleets after Day 1:
Malta:
El Duque, Algiers, HMS Algiers, L’Aube, Le Bon Marin
Barbary States:
Whisper, Marrakech, Tiger’s Eye
Fleets after Day 2:
Malta:
Algiers, HMS Algiers, HMS Oxford, Le Bon Marin, L’Aube, Le Favori
Barbary Pirates:
Tiger’s Eye, Queen of Sheba, Marrakech, Terror of Gibraltar, Whisper
El Duque was sunk by Hawkins, Admiral Castro going down with it. England’s assumed control for Malta, with Admiral Blake joining the coalition and nearly taking down the Tiger’s Eye in the process.
Rule Changes: 24 turns is too much. It’ll go to 12 per day, so the ships “go home” once night falls. Day 3 and 4 will be “skipped” as I’ve already played 48 turns. I’ll play Day 5 tomorrow, Day 6 Sunday, then skip Mon-Tues if the game is still going.
So I just completed Day 1.
I just can’t find a big enough flat space for this game in my house, I wanted to make the islands 6L at least apart but it wound up being 4.
“Tunis” “Tripoli” and “Algiers” were all placed to roughly resemble their places on the Barbary Coast, with Algiers and Tunis closer to the wild islands (and Malta) than Tripoli. Wild islands were placed for balance, not realism. One was close to Algiers, one close to Malta, and two neutral. A fog bank lies between the neutral islands and Malta, a reef bank between the neutral islands and the Barbary Coast, and a Sargasso Sea off to the east.
Too late to change it but I gave each Barbary city 10 food to start, and Malta 30. This worked to create a sense of the Barbary Coast being on the backfoot, but Malta’s got a big advantage in ship power already since they didn’t need to worry about food for several turns.
The Corsair ship Algiers was captured and I actually forgot to give Malta their 5 gold. Whoops. Gonna do a longer write up over on the Battle Reports section now.
That’s a good point about how it could be used to unfairly delay ships. I was thinking that that would be a nerf, but it might actually be less powerful if you had to risk everything at once.
—–
So for my next game, I’m coming up with a scenario sort of riffing off your Economy Edition but not quite as intensive, but still quite long. I ordered Aruj Barbarossa online, and as it will take between 2-3 weeks to get here from the UK, I’m coming up with a scenario to play in the meantime.
The Barbary Corsairs have to survive until Barbarossa arrives. The Knights of Malta (Spain/England/France mixed fleet) are trying to starve them out.
Each of them will start with 40 point fleets, and can exchange coins for ships/crew at their HI of equal value. The Corsairs have three HIs: Tunis, Tripoli, Algiers. The Knights of Malta only have Malta. As long as at least one HI remains under Corsair control when Barbarossa arrives, they’ll win.
Named crew can not be regained if they’re eliminated. Same with ships. The Barbary Corsairs may use generic Pirate crew if I run out of generic Corsairs.
The part I’m taking from your Economy Edition is food and blockades. All three islands need to feed themselves, afterall. So in addition to new ships/crew, they can turn gold into food, probably at a 1:2 ratio. Each HI goes through one food per turn. The Knights of Malta can declare a blockade if one of their ships is within L of a Barbary HI. A blockading ship will eliminate one food per mast it currently has per turn. If a Barbary HI runs out of food, and a Maltese ship is blockading it, it surrenders. If Malta runs out of food… I don’t know. They don’t lose, though.
Finally, ALL Barbary Corsair ships are considered to have the Barbary Banner UT on board, and ALL Malta ships are considered to have the Banner of Malta UT on board.
My Barbary Coast packs had a lot of stuff I already own, which I kind of expected, but were worth it.
I pulled myself twice, with two BC Jack Hawkins, which will help out my Corsair fleets a lot. I also got Algiers back, which I’d broken a long time ago, as well as the Poseidon’s Breath UT. Wicked Kareen, Whisper, and Marrakesh are all decent ships I didn’t already have.
I also got First Mate Ismail and Admiral Robert Blake to help out an England collection that is really lacking for strong English named crew.
Repeats were Concord, Bey’s Revenge, Agha’s Whip, and Duque Marques Vaccaro.
