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Now that the Rules survey has some results (61 responses as of this post), I think it would be a good idea to discuss some various options in detail.
Are there any other changes to the 4 main actions you would recommend? Any new main actions you would add?
realoading guns that fired for one turn before shooting them again. If a 5 mast ship shoot 2 times on turn A, on turn B he’s realoading 2 and can fire 3
(different response)
I would add a new action called “Recruit” which would allow home island-docked ship to exchange gold for new generic crews, however this would not allow a fleet to exceed their starting fleet point limit or the point limit of the ship.
Are there any other ways to determine player order that you use/prefer?
Each round to be randomized. We use this in other games where each turn it’s a random order where we have 3+ player games.
I typically play 3 player games (when not in campaign mode), and determine player order a couple of ways. All players roll dice and highest goes first, with play continuing to the left. Oldest player goes first and descends to the youngest, and vice-versa.
I typically play 3 player games (when not in campaign mode), and determine player order a couple of ways. All players roll dice and highest goes first, with play continuing to the left.
I think that’s the best way to do it. Once in a while you have the issue of whoever goes first gets attacked (since the starting player can’t shoot at anyone docked at their home islands), but I think it might be too confusing or variable to let the highest-rolling player CHOOSE where they go in the turn order (such as choosing to go second, or 3rd out of 5 players, etc).
Not long ago I was in favor of having the player order determined by all the initiative rolls, with the second-highest roll going second and so on. However, I think continuing to the left from the first player will have win out, especially seeing that 77% of respondents think that way.
Not long ago I was in favor of having the player order determined by all the initiative rolls, with the second-highest roll going second and so on.
We’ve done that, but it usually feels like either oldest to youngest player or the other way around, since there are only 3 of us normally. We have yet to get a meaningful game in with all 5 of us, but I’ve tried a couple times in the past.
Are there any other changes to the 4 main actions you would recommend? Any new main actions you would add?
realoading guns that fired for one turn before shooting them again. If a 5 mast ship shoot 2 times on turn A, on turn B he’s realoading 2 and can fire 3
That’s adding complexity and tracking requirements that this game doesn’t really need, unless you’re planning to completely overhaul the combat system to make it more like a sim with realism for the sake of realism.
(different response)
I would add a new action called “Recruit” which would allow home island-docked ship to exchange gold for new generic crews, however this would not allow a fleet to exceed their starting fleet point limit or the point limit of the ship.
That’s fine for a long-term game with multiple focuses, or a campaign style game, but is completely unnecessary if the primary focus remains on collecting gold.
Being restricted by the original fleet limit during the game makes towing and capturing ships problematic, especially if you wanted to recruit new/replacement crew for those ships.
Are there any other ways to determine player order that you use/prefer?
Each round to be randomized. We use this in other games where each turn it’s a random order where we have 3+ player games.
Randomized turn order works well in games with relatively small and quick turns where you have just one or two game pieces and a couple actions to perform. Someone else jumping ahead, or you getting two turns in a row, isn’t going to throw things off too much, especially when it could swing right back the next round.
I think it becomes much less beneficial, and often detrimental, in games that have far more involved turns and player/piece elimination because it can create such large imbalances and swings. With just four players, it could vary from A-A (two turns in a row), all the way to A-B-C-D-B-C-D-A (six full turns in between!). If bad turn luck hit you at the wrong time, your entire fleet of a dozen ships could get wiped out in that span, with nothing you can do about it. It makes long-term planning difficult, and leaves you largely at the mercy of the randomizer.
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One system I’ve seen that was a bit complicated, but worked really, really well, was in the old Wizkids Crimson Skies game.
Players would roll initiative at the beginning of the round (adding modifiers if they had any) to set the turn order. (Movement in that game was planned and performed simultaneously, and relative speeds were taken into account, but neither of those would be a factor here.) When it got to each player’s turn, they got to take one action with one of their planes. Then the next player would get one action, and so on. When it got back to the first player, they again got to take one action with one of their planes that hadn’t already taken an action. You’d continue looping through like this until every plane had taken every possible action (some had tail guns, which would take actions separate from their nose guns). It was almost like having simultaneous actions, without actually being simultaneous.
The initiative ranking meant turn order was variable, and while going first was a advantage because of how damage was handled (the planes used dials like Mechwarrior, Mage Knight, and HeroClix), threading all of the player actions together gave other players opportunities to react before it was too late. In that game, the planes had already moved before the shooting phase started, so a big part of the strategy was prioritizing where to shoot first.
Adapting that to Pirates wouldn’t be difficult. Players could still roll for initiative (certain less-common crew could provide a bonus) or it could be randomized in some other way, and then each player in turn gives one action to one of their ships. If it was a move action, you’d get to do everything attached to that full action (move-shoot-ram-board-etc.) before the next player took an action. If one of your ships had an extra action, instead of being able to use it immediately, it would simply let you give that ship a second action later in the round when it got to be your turn again.
I agree with Woelf about the reloading. It becomes a major obstacles as the size of the game increases.
Personally the last two pirates games I’ve played this summer utilized a return fire mechanism. Basically after a ship was shot at it had the opportunity to shoot back with whatever cannons remained and are in range. So far it adds an extra level of tactics to the fame (crossing the T becomes more important which is thematic and realistic)
We are going to try and play a game where ships can return fire with all of the cannons the ship started with that turn (prior to being shot) making the return fire more deadly.
As for turn order I think a simple mechanisms of rotating starting player would be interesting but I have not found it necessary to add.
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