Questions About Game Rules & The Pirate Code

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  • #17727
    Ben
    Keymaster

    One of Darrin’s old fleets (the Miniature Trading member who invented the UPS fleet archetype as far as I know) made me peruse the Mysterious Islands again and ponder some effects.

    MI #15 seems particularly wild, especially in the case of Unique Treasures. “5-6: Randomly move one treasure coin from this island to your home island.”  Perhaps I’ll start with a question that might put you in a good mood, before this gets ugly.  XD  😉   It’s been rather amusing to think about all of this today.

    Ex: Bad Maps is flung home via the MI. I assume you can look at it since it’s your treasure. An enemy ship then raids your home island, ending up with the Maps (allowing the controller to move their own HI in a 1v1 game). Can you use Bad Maps to “ram” friendly turtles to get a bunch of them home safely all of a sudden without having them move to touch the HI?

    What happens if Cursed Natives is revealed during an HI raid?

    Can flinging home the Altar of the Loa cause it to be operational? It seems that it would work, after giving an explore action to explore your own HI.

    Does the effect of the Rum UT last for all player turns following it being loaded, or just the controller’s next turn?  I’m thinking about it being found during an HI raid after the MI effect gets used, then a 3rd player using All-Powerful to try and force the drunken crew to go back for more with a repeat theft attempt.

    When using Bad Maps, does it function as a linear movement that can be blocked by islands/terrain/ships, or can the opposing player move things up and over/under stuff as long as no contact is made by the end placement?

    -If the island ends up close enough to another island, can a ship (such as a 10 master with a wide bow) dock at multiple islands at the same time?

    A [custom] UT could give itself a negative value, but it would have to explicitly say so.

    Due to that, I assume that Rum can’t be worth negative gold if there are 7+ crew on the ship that finds it?

    Can you unload a facedown Abandoned Crew on your home island, then voluntarily reveal it to make it crew? (including during an opponent’s turn)

    Does the Trees UT get loaded onto a ship using it at all?

    #17733
    Woelf
    Moderator

    One of Darrin’s old fleets (the Miniature Trading member who invented the UPS fleet archetype as far as I know) made me peruse the Mysterious Islands again and ponder some effects.

    MI #15 seems particularly wild, especially in the case of Unique Treasures. “5-6: Randomly move one treasure coin from this island to your home island.”  Perhaps I’ll start with a question that might put you in a good mood, before this gets ugly.  XD  😉   It’s been rather amusing to think about all of this today.

    Ex: Bad Maps is flung home via the MI. I assume you can look at it since it’s your treasure. An enemy ship then raids your home island, ending up with the Maps (allowing the controller to move their own HI in a 1v1 game). Can you use Bad Maps to “ram” friendly turtles to get a bunch of them home safely all of a sudden without having them move to touch the HI?

    What happens if Cursed Natives is revealed during an HI raid?

    Can flinging home the Altar of the Loa cause it to be operational? It seems that it would work, after giving an explore action to explore your own HI.

    MIs break things in some weird ways, so I should probably add an entire section to the PC that goes into more detail.

    In general, UTs that do not produce a gold value will not function if they end up on a home island, and they are not eligible to be targeted by other effects, with the exception of something like Kharmic Idol if the UT was face up.    They’re essentially set aside, and can’t be stolen or activated.

    The ones that do have a gold value (Rum, etc.) do retain their values and can be stolen like regular treasures.

    Does the effect of the Rum UT last for all player turns following it being loaded, or just the controller’s next turn?  I’m thinking about it being found during an HI raid after the MI effect gets used, then a 3rd player using All-Powerful to try and force the drunken crew to go back for more with a repeat theft attempt.

    It applies to the ship’s next turn, so if it changes hands immediately after picking up Rum, it can’t be given an action by the new controller during the turn it was captured.

    When using Bad Maps, does it function as a linear movement that can be blocked by islands/terrain/ships, or can the opposing player move things up and over/under stuff as long as no contact is made by the end placement?

    It moves like an iceberg, so it has to stop if it would hit something.  It can’t jump over things, even if the full movement would clear.

    -If the island ends up close enough to another island, can a ship (such as a 10 master with a wide bow) dock at multiple islands at the same time?

    No.  Even if a ship could physically touch its bow to two islands at once, it can still only dock at one of them at a time.   The controller can choose which, and it would have to move at least a little bit before it could switch to the other.

    A [custom] UT could give itself a negative value, but it would have to explicitly say so.

    Due to that, I assume that Rum can’t be worth negative gold if there are 7+ crew on the ship that finds it?

    Correct.  If there are more than 6 crew, the value stops at zero.

    Can you unload a facedown Abandoned Crew on your home island, then voluntarily reveal it to make it crew? (including during an opponent’s turn)

    Abandoned Crew can only be revealed when you use their abilities, so you can’t reveal one simply to prevent it from being grabbed by something that takes treasure.   Because they are treated like standard, non-unique treasure, they could be taken by a HI-Raider if they were face down on your home island.

    Does the Trees UT get loaded onto a ship using it at all?

    No.   You either use it immediately to repair your ship, or leave it face down on the island.

    #17736
    Jared Nicholes
    Participant

    Hi everyone,

    I’m a new member, and I’m just getting back into Pirates CSG. I used to play a long time ago, and then I fell out of it. Now I’m 27, and I’m getting back into it.

    I like to collect the packs, specifically pirates of the Revolution and oceans edge. To be honest, I prefer the revolution packs, I don’t know why. I also have the 10 mast delusion.

    I am posting today in need of some advice concerning rules for a three player game. On February 3, we are having a lot of people over for a party. There will be a lot of games. I wanted to bring out this game. However, I’ve only done two player games, and I want more people to be included. This is why I want to try a three player game.

    I did a demo run 40 point 3 player game with my family, and it seemed to go by way too fast. There were only six islands, home islands included, and 45 points worth of gold, 24 pieces total and one unique treasure.

    There also wasn’t much cannon fire in the game, if you know what I mean.

    Here is my rules question. How many islands at minimum should there be for a three player game? How many gold points and pieces of gold for a three player game? How exactly should I set it up?

    Can someone please help me out so we can all have fun with this game at the party?

    Regards,

    Jared

    #17743
    Jared Nicholes
    Participant

    Never mind, I was able to figure it out thanks to the game rules section here. After a thorough read through, I discovered what I was doing wrong.

    I did another demo game, and it was a lot more fun and a lot better. I think I’m ready to introduce this game to the party.

    Thanks again,

    Jared

    #17744
    Ben
    Keymaster

    I did another demo game, and it was a lot more fun and a lot better. I think I’m ready to introduce this game to the party.

    Glad to hear it!

    Sometimes it can be fun to change up the default rules too, beyond the regular 3 islands per player and 4 coins per wild island.  Just depends on how long you have for the game, and how much action you want there to be. (more gold and more islands = usually a longer game)

    #17746
    Ben
    Keymaster

    Does a facedown Oarsman crew not take up cargo space?  I seem to remember that being the case from a previous rules question answered long ago, but just want to be sure.

    #17747
    Jared Nicholes
    Participant

    I just pulled out an oarsman from a revolution pack to check this for you. It says on the card “If derelict, this ship gains a base move of +S. This crew takes up no cargo space.”

    #17748
    Ben
    Keymaster

    I just pulled out an oarsman from a revolution pack to check this for you. It says on the card “If derelict, this ship gains a base move of +S. This crew takes up no cargo space.”

    I’m aware of that, but the question is about whether or not the “takes up no cargo space” ability functions while face down (or if you have to reveal it in order to get that benefit).  Normally crew can only have their abilities apply while face up, but I thought there was an exception to crew that don’t take up cargo space.

    Woelf will be able to provide clarity.  🙂

    #17749
    Jared Nicholes
    Participant

    I always just flipped it face up when I was loading treasure to show it takes up no cargo space. I do the same with linked crew/ships.

    I am not sure if this is correct, though.

    #17750
    Ben
    Keymaster

     

    I do the same with linked crew/ships.

    Links are covered in The Pirate Code, page 4:

    –Links function even if crew are facedown.

    —If a linked crew is facedown and its link is required to make the setup legal you must indicate to your opponents that a link is present, but you are not required to indicate which specific link is in use. If necessary, a Privateer may be asked to verify it is legal without revealing the crew.

     

    #17751
    Jared Nicholes
    Participant

    That makes sense. I was wondering about that. Thank you for pointing that out.

    I’m still learning about this game, so thanks for helping me out.

    #17754
    Ben
    Keymaster

    I see that the Plague UT can eliminate a Ransom crew.  If Plague is used to eliminate the Ransom crew in a hostile manner (such as intentionally ramming the enemy ship to take out their crew), does the player who used Plague to eliminate the Ransom crew receive the 1 gold payout?

    Can you cancel the Eternal and Fear keywords granted by the Manawa nö Köwhatu UT?  (“This ship gains the Eternal and Fear keywords.”)

    For the units in play tiebreaker, must the unit(s) be capable of an action of some kind when the game ends, or as a game piece in general? (such as when the game started)  I can think of some situations such as a ship that can’t be given any of the actions, but could explore if it was moved into contact with an island.  Similarly, abandoned forts can’t be given shoot actions with no cannons.  Another strange one would be an Eternal sea creature that has no segments and has been moved away from the home island – unless it is “killed” again, it can’t be given an action.

    A “unit” is defined as any game piece that can be directly given at least one of the four primary actions (move, shoot, repair, or explore). This includes ships, sea creatures, flotillas, forts, and crew with the Marine keyword, but does not include events, equipment, treasure, or non-Marine crew

    #17757
    Woelf
    Moderator

    Does a facedown Oarsman crew not take up cargo space?  I seem to remember that being the case from a previous rules question answered long ago, but just want to be sure.

    The “no space” ability only functions while face up.     Links are one of the few things that do still work while facedown, because they’re not abilities (excluding the handful that are).

    I see that the Plague UT can eliminate a Ransom crew.  If Plague is used to eliminate the Ransom crew in a hostile manner (such as intentionally ramming the enemy ship to take out their crew), does the player who used Plague to eliminate the Ransom crew receive the 1 gold payout?

    It’s a bit more of a gray area, but that elimination still counts toward Plague, rather than the player who delivered it, so no one gets the Ransom payout.

    Can you cancel the Eternal and Fear keywords granted by the Manawa nö Köwhatu UT?  (“This ship gains the Eternal and Fear keywords.”)

    Yes, because the ship gains the keywords.   If the UT text simply read, “Eternal, Fear” you’d need Jailhouse Dog or something else that targeted UTs directly to shut them down.

    For the units in play tiebreaker, must the unit(s) be capable of an action of some kind when the game ends, or as a game piece in general? (such as when the game started)  I can think of some situations such as a ship that can’t be given any of the actions, but could explore if it was moved into contact with an island.  Similarly, abandoned forts can’t be given shoot actions with no cannons.  Another strange one would be an Eternal sea creature that has no segments and has been moved away from the home island – unless it is “killed” again, it can’t be given an action.

    A “unit” is defined as any game piece that can be directly given at least one of the four primary actions (move, shoot, repair, or explore). This includes ships, sea creatures, flotillas, forts, and crew with the Marine keyword, but does not include events, equipment, treasure, or non-Marine crew

    That tiebreaker doesn’t care about the current status of any of the units.   As long as they’re still in play they count, even if they couldn’t be given an action at that time due to damage or any other factors.

    #17761
    Xerecs
    Moderator

    Are the effects of Mysterious Islands considered public knowledge to other players, or is the contributing player the only one who knows what the islands do until they’re revealed?

    Also, the Code states:

    Mysterious Island effects cannot be re-rolled

    Does this refer to the individual effects of the island or the determination of which effect happens when you dock at one?

    For example, I have a ship with re-roll dock at Mysterious Island #13. Am I not allowed to re-roll the roll to determine which 1-6 effect takes place, or am I not allowed to re-roll the 1-2 island effect?

    MI #13:

    1-2: Roll 4d6. For every 4-6 result, eliminate one of this ship’s masts.
    3-4: No effect.
    5-6: Move an opposing ship using her base move.

    ———————————————————

    A question regarding the No-Duplicates rule. The very last line of the entry in the Code states:

    “The no-duplicates rule applies to unique treasures only during setup, when placing them in the treasure pool. If an ability or effect allows you to bring in additional unique treasures, you may duplicate ones that are currently in play”

    Could the same ruling be applied to Events? At set-up you can’t have two of the same Event, such as Duel or Divers, but if you are able to add them to your fleet during a game, could you add a duplicate?

    As I’m writing I think this answers that:

    “If an ability or effect allows you to bring in a named crew, event token, or other game piece from outside of the game, you may choose one that was previously removed from the game or eliminated without violating the no-duplicates rule, provided that both “copies” of that game piece are not in your fleet at the same time.”

     

     

    #17766
    Ben
    Keymaster

    Is the “nearest” part of Hidden Cove always measured from the ship you intend to teleport with it?  Is it always the player’s choice whether it’s the nearest unexplored WI or nearest WI with no treasure on it, or does it have to be the closest of those two options regardless of what they want?

    Reveal this event at the beginning of one of your turns: As a free action, dock one of your ships at the nearest unexplored wild island or the nearest wild island with no treasure on it.

    MI #15 says: “1-2: The next time you give this ship a move action, she can move only S.”

    I assume that means S overall and ignores bonuses? (or changes base move to S)

    For the Dead Man’s Chest/Pension UT’s, must the crew be on your ships in order to be eliminated and get the gold? (or are they considered “in your fleet” if on a wild island or your home island) If they do have to be on ships, is there an exception for crew inside forts you control? Even if crew on islands won’t count towards the new gold, can you eliminate them anyway (perhaps to avoid them falling into the hands of another player) via the UT?

    When Dead Man’s Chest is unloaded at your home island, you can eliminate any number of crew in your fleet; each is worth 1 gold.

    Similarly, is a crew considered to be “in your fleet” if you load an enemy crew from a wild island via the free transfer rule, and then just unload it right after?  Or is a non-Marine crew on a wild island not considered part of any player’s fleet?

    Does the gold from Dead Man’s Chest/Pension show up in coin form on your home island from outside the game, or is it a total number assigned to the face up UT? (thinking about how Kharmic Idol can eliminate it later on – would that gold disappear as well)  Pension eliminates itself afterwards, but the DMC does not.

    #17770
    Woelf
    Moderator

    Are the effects of Mysterious Islands considered public knowledge to other players, or is the contributing player the only one who knows what the islands do until they’re revealed?

    Also, the Code states:

    Mysterious Island effects cannot be re-rolled

    Does this refer to the individual effects of the island or the determination of which effect happens when you dock at one?

    For example, I have a ship with re-roll dock at Mysterious Island #13. Am I not allowed to re-roll the roll to determine which 1-6 effect takes place, or am I not allowed to re-roll the 1-2 island effect?

    You cannot reroll anything for Mysterious Islands, whether it’s the initial docking roll or an extra effect within that.   The only help you can get is from the Ex-Pat keyword, or some other theoretical ability that very specifically refers to MI rolls.

    A question regarding the No-Duplicates rule. The very last line of the entry in the Code states:

    “The no-duplicates rule applies to unique treasures only during setup, when placing them in the treasure pool. If an ability or effect allows you to bring in additional unique treasures, you may duplicate ones that are currently in play”

    Could the same ruling be applied to Events? At set-up you can’t have two of the same Event, such as Duel or Divers, but if you are able to add them to your fleet during a game, could you add a duplicate?

    As I’m writing I think this answers that:

    “If an ability or effect allows you to bring in a named crew, event token, or other game piece from outside of the game, you may choose one that was previously removed from the game or eliminated without violating the no-duplicates rule, provided that both “copies” of that game piece are not in your fleet at the same time.”

    As you found, Events are limited the same way as crew.   If one had already been used, its effect was completed, and it had been removed from the game, it could potentially be brought back in later, similar to how an eliminated/removed crew could be brought back, as long as there was never more than one copy of it in play at a time.

    The primary reason an exception is made for UTs is because it gets a lot more complicated with treasure reveals and abilities that can peek at things.    Some players could know that a facedown treasure is a specific UT, but until it’s actually revealed somehow, it can technically still be duplicated by Pandora’s Box or anything else that added them during the game.  Being a “shared” resource due to the random island distribution means there’s also no way to enforce duplicates on a fleet-specific basis, at least beyond the initial setup, unlike most other things.

    #17771
    Woelf
    Moderator

    Is the “nearest” part of Hidden Cove always measured from the ship you intend to teleport with it?  Is it always the player’s choice whether it’s the nearest unexplored WI or nearest WI with no treasure on it, or does it have to be the closest of those two options regardless of what they want?

    Reveal this event at the beginning of one of your turns: As a free action, dock one of your ships at the nearest unexplored wild island or the nearest wild island with no treasure on it.

    “Nearest” is relative to the ship you intend to move.   You can choose either option – it does not have to be the nearest of both.

    MI #15 says: “1-2: The next time you give this ship a move action, she can move only S.”

    I assume that means S overall and ignores bonuses? (or changes base move to S)

    S overall, because it doesn’t refer to the ship’s base move.  Any bonuses that would add to movement are ignored.

    For the Dead Man’s Chest/Pension UT’s, must the crew be on your ships in order to be eliminated and get the gold? (or are they considered “in your fleet” if on a wild island or your home island) If they do have to be on ships, is there an exception for crew inside forts you control? Even if crew on islands won’t count towards the new gold, can you eliminate them anyway (perhaps to avoid them falling into the hands of another player) via the UT?

    When Dead Man’s Chest is unloaded at your home island, you can eliminate any number of crew in your fleet; each is worth 1 gold.

    Similarly, is a crew considered to be “in your fleet” if you load an enemy crew from a wild island via the free transfer rule, and then just unload it right after?  Or is a non-Marine crew on a wild island not considered part of any player’s fleet?

    With the exception of Marines, crew on wild islands are technically not owned by anyone, and can be loaded/claimed by any ship that docks there.  For that UT, the crew would have to be on one of your own ships and/or your home island.

    Crew in forts don’t count, because the fort can be destroyed to revert it back to a normal wild island.

    Does the gold from Dead Man’s Chest/Pension show up in coin form on your home island from outside the game, or is it a total number assigned to the face up UT? (thinking about how Kharmic Idol can eliminate it later on – would that gold disappear as well)  Pension eliminates itself afterwards, but the DMC does not.

    The way it’s worded, it doesn’t assign the value to the UT itself (even though it really should), so the value you gain is tracked with whatever external recording system you’re using for other gold modifiers.  Removing the UT later won’t affect it.

    #17781
    Ben
    Keymaster

    I’m curious about this as well:

    Are the effects of Mysterious Islands considered public knowledge to other players, or is the contributing player the only one who knows what the islands do until they’re revealed?

    It seems that a player could look at the back of any islands they place as part of the random draw when executing the Setup rules. (“players take turns randomly choosing an island”)

    #17792
    Woelf
    Moderator

    I’m curious about this as well:

    Are the effects of Mysterious Islands considered public knowledge to other players, or is the contributing player the only one who knows what the islands do until they’re revealed?

    It seems that a player could look at the back of any islands they place as part of the random draw when executing the Setup rules. (“players take turns randomly choosing an island”)

    I don’t remember offhand, and can’t check at the moment, but are they numbered or uniquely marked in any way on the back sides?

    If they can be identified accurately without actually revealing the side with text, they would become public knowledge as soon as they’re placed.

    If it’s just the MI symbol, they’re treated as hidden until they actually get revealed during gameplay.  The player(s) placing them will know which islands they were placing, but other players will not.   (A player that memorized each shape might be able to make a reasonable guess, but I think there’s enough variety and overlap that no specific island shape is unique to any specific MI effect.)

    #17794
    Ben
    Keymaster

    I don’t remember offhand, and can’t check at the moment, but are they numbered or uniquely marked in any way on the back sides?

    Only the MI symbol for the ones from MI, but the SS islands are numbered.

    The player(s) placing them will know which islands they were placing, but other players will not.

    Interesting, that makes sense to me.  So if you end up placing an MI you didn’t contribute (due to the random choice), you can check out the effects for yourself before placing it.  Would be a funny way to potentially get tipped off about an opponent’s strategy!

    #17796
    Xerecs
    Moderator

    Could the ability of the Maui’s Fishhook be used on a submerged target, be it a Submarine or Sea Monster?

    Ability for reference:

    Once per turn as part of a move action, this ship can randomly take one treasure from any ship up to S away from her.

     

    #17797
    Ben
    Keymaster

    In The Pirate Code, it says this about gold bonus abilities that add value to a treasure:

    -These abilities have no effect on the values of unique treasures.

    Why is that?  How would a player/layperson know not to apply the bonus based on the simple ability text?

    One of this ship’s treasures is worth +2 gold when she docks at your home island.

     

    If 058 Captain Jack Sparrow trades a coin to avoid his ship being affected by Blood Money/Bloody Gold, I assume the receiving ship has to then eliminate a crew to satisfy the UT requirement?

    CJS: When this ship is given an explore action, you can swap a treasure on the wild island a crew on any friendly ship.

    Blood Money: Instead of loading Blood Money, put it face-up on the wild island. Then reveal all treasure on the island. Each time a ship loads a non-unique treasure from the island, eliminate a crew on that ship that has a point value equal to or greater than the value of that treasure. Eliminate Blood Money when there is no non-unique treasure on the island. Spanish ships are not affected by Blood Money.

    Similarly, if CJS trades a coin instead of loading one from an island that Cursed/Savage Natives is on, can the receiving ship only load that one coin for that turn?  I can’t tell if the Cursed/Savage Natives UT’s are triggered per explore action, or per turn. (ex: if it’s per explore, you could redock and explore again for a second coin)

    Cursed Natives: When revealed, roll a d6. On a result of 1–3, eliminate the crew on this ship that has the lowest point value; on a 4–6, eliminate the crew that has the highest point value. Then this ship can load one more treasure (only). Then put Cursed Natives face down on the island; this ship must leave the island on your next turn. Cursed ships and crew are not affected by Cursed Natives.

    Can CJS trade Cursed/Savage Natives to another ship?  It just says “the island” rather than “this island”, so it seems you might be able to trade it to another ship docked at an island.

    In regards to the Becalmed event:

    -When affected by Becalmed, a ship with an Oarsman, a keyword such as Galley, Longship, Turbine, or Turtle Ship, or any other ability that allows movement while derelict may move as if it had no masts remaining.

    Why as if it had no masts remaining?  The event just says “unless she can move when derelict”, but gives no indication that the base move should be reduced to S, or that the assumption is as if the ship had no masts.  I understand the thematic reasoning, but I don’t think the ability text of the card supports the Code ruling.

    #17801
    Woelf
    Moderator

    The player(s) placing them will know which islands they were placing, but other players will not.

    Interesting, that makes sense to me.  So if you end up placing an MI you didn’t contribute (due to the random choice), you can check out the effects for yourself before placing it.  Would be a funny way to potentially get tipped off about an opponent’s strategy!

    I should clarify that they can only look at the ones they contributed.   It’s been so long since I used the standard placement rules that I’d forgotten they go into a shared pool before  placement.    If you place one contributed by another player you’ll know it’s a MI, but you won’t necessarily know which specific one it was.

    #17802
    Woelf
    Moderator

    Could the ability of the Maui’s Fishhook be used on a submerged target, be it a Submarine or Sea Monster?

    Ability for reference:

    Once per turn as part of a move action, this ship can randomly take one treasure from any ship up to S away from her.

    Yes, that ability can be used on (or by) a submerged ship.   Unlike the Hoist abilities, it does not require contact.

    #17803
    Woelf
    Moderator

    In The Pirate Code, it says this about gold bonus abilities that add value to a treasure:

    -These abilities have no effect on the values of unique treasures.

    Why is that?  How would a player/layperson know not to apply the bonus based on the simple ability text?

    One of this ship’s treasures is worth +2 gold when she docks at your home island.

    That goes way back to the early days, but I think one of the original intents was to maintain a clear distinction between the coins with a numerical (printed) value and UTs that produce a value, by allowing bonuses to apply only to the ones with printed values.

    If 058 Captain Jack Sparrow trades a coin to avoid his ship being affected by Blood Money/Bloody Gold, I assume the receiving ship has to then eliminate a crew to satisfy the UT requirement?

    CJS: When this ship is given an explore action, you can swap a treasure on the wild island a crew on any friendly ship.

    Blood Money: Instead of loading Blood Money, put it face-up on the wild island. Then reveal all treasure on the island. Each time a ship loads a non-unique treasure from the island, eliminate a crew on that ship that has a point value equal to or greater than the value of that treasure. Eliminate Blood Money when there is no non-unique treasure on the island. Spanish ships are not affected by Blood Money.

    The ship that actually loads the treasure suffers the penalty.

    Similarly, if CJS trades a coin instead of loading one from an island that Cursed/Savage Natives is on, can the receiving ship only load that one coin for that turn?  I can’t tell if the Cursed/Savage Natives UT’s are triggered per explore action, or per turn. (ex: if it’s per explore, you could redock and explore again for a second coin)

    Cursed Natives: When revealed, roll a d6. On a result of 1–3, eliminate the crew on this ship that has the lowest point value; on a 4–6, eliminate the crew that has the highest point value. Then this ship can load one more treasure (only). Then put Cursed Natives face down on the island; this ship must leave the island on your next turn. Cursed ships and crew are not affected by Cursed Natives.

    Cursed/Savage Natives applies to the ship that revealed it, which in this scenario is CJS’s ship.  After rolling and applying the effect, he can then use his ability normally, with no harmful effects on the other ship involved in the trade.

    The “one more treasure” restriction applies only to that specific explore action, not the full turn.

    Can CJS trade Cursed/Savage Natives to another ship?  It just says “the island” rather than “this island”, so it seems you might be able to trade it to another ship docked at an island.

    Even though it returns to the island face down, he cannot trade it away, per this line in the PC under his ability:

    -This ability is applied after resolving any and all unique treasures on the island. If the UT must be loaded onto this ship or it must remain on the island, it cannot be swapped for a crew.

     

     

    In regards to the Becalmed event:

    -When affected by Becalmed, a ship with an Oarsman, a keyword such as Galley, Longship, Turbine, or Turtle Ship, or any other ability that allows movement while derelict may move as if it had no masts remaining.

    Why as if it had no masts remaining?  The event just says “unless she can move when derelict”, but gives no indication that the base move should be reduced to S, or that the assumption is as if the ship had no masts.  I understand the thematic reasoning, but I don’t think the ability text of the card supports the Code ruling.

    That’s just outdated wording that didn’t get updated when a distinction between having no masts and being derelict was introduced to the game.  I’ll make a note to fix it.

    Any ship that can move without masts, derelict or not, can still move while under the effect of Becalmed, but their movement is reduced to whatever it would be when using that movement ability under normal circumstances.

    #17806
    Ben
    Keymaster

    That goes way back to the early days, but I think one of the original intents was to maintain a clear distinction between the coins with a numerical (printed) value and UTs that produce a value, by allowing bonuses to apply only to the ones with printed values.

    Interesting. I think it makes more sense when using a “replacement” method for gold bonuses, such as a 5 becoming a 6 from outside the game.  I’ve become accustomed (and prefer) using the method where new coins are introduced from outside the game while keeping the originals (5 and 1 separate on the HI), which makes it easier to house rule bonuses applying to UT’s.

    #17811
    Ben
    Keymaster

    Woelf, do you know if “The Navigator” (Leon Keller) was someone involved with the rules at Wizkids, or a fan of the game in the community?  I’m slowly reorganizing my oldest PCSG document and fixing some links, and came across the name in the original MT rules thread (or at least the biggest/most recent one – 143+ pages!).

    I think it would be great if the next Pirate Code update included the No-Duplicates List. (hopefully easy to include as it’s already made)

    #17814
    Woelf
    Moderator

    Woelf, do you know if “The Navigator” (Leon Keller) was someone involved with the rules at Wizkids, or a fan of the game in the community?  I’m slowly reorganizing my oldest PCSG document and fixing some links, and came across the name in the original MT rules thread (or at least the biggest/most recent one – 143+ pages!).

    I don’t think he was directly connected with WK.    As far as I know, he was one of the earlier superfans of the game who created a lot of good content and reference pages, similar to what you’ve been doing for many years now.

    I think it would be great if the next Pirate Code update included the No-Duplicates List. (hopefully easy to include as it’s already made)

    That’s a good idea.   I’d purposely kept it out of previous editions because it was still in flux, but it’s safe to say it has stabilized by this point.  😀

    #17815
    Ben
    Keymaster

    Regarding spyer abilities, are players allowed to shuffle the cargo on a ship’s deckplate around to make it harder for an opponent to spy something different each turn?  (such as going left to right on face down crew across a deckplate)

    “Once per turn, this ship may look at one face-down cargo on any ship.”

    Probably a pretty hard thing to enforce if they can’t shuffle, though it should be that way in my opinion because it doesn’t specify that the selection is random.

    #17816
    Woelf
    Moderator

    Regarding spyer abilities, are players allowed to shuffle the cargo on a ship’s deckplate around to make it harder for an opponent to spy something different each turn?  (such as going left to right on face down crew across a deckplate)

    “Once per turn, this ship may look at one face-down cargo on any ship.”

    Probably a pretty hard thing to enforce if they can’t shuffle, though it should be that way in my opinion because it doesn’t specify that the selection is random.

    It doesn’t specify that it’s random, but it also isn’t meant to allow either player to control which specific treasure gets looked at, so it should always be at least semi-random.

    The player with the treasure can rearrange them however they want, but the player with the spying ability can still choose which of those to look at.   Treat it similar to a card game when someone gets the option to look at or pick a card from someone else’s hand; the player with the cards can arrange them any way they want, but the other still gets to choose from what they can see.

    All of the different treasure backs that can mix together complicate things a bit, but that can be mitigated somewhat by forcing everyone to contribute only a single type of back, or by using proxies for the mismatched ones.  Or, just play them as-is.

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