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  • #11963
    Jack
    Participant

    I’ve never posted in this thread before, but I have a few I’ve thought of over the years.

    Laurens de Graaf

    Type: Crew

    Nation: Pirates

    Point cost: 5

    Ability: Born Leader. This ship gets +1 to its Cannon and boarding rolls against the Spanish.

    Flavor text: De Graaf fancies himself a mercenary. Admiral Morgan holds him in higher regard than any other pirate. The Spanish, however, see him as the Devil himself. The entire Armada de Barlovento is on the lookout for him, and de Graaf may just be daring enough to take them head on.

    Anne Dieu-le-Veut

    Type: Crew

    Nation: Pirates

    Cost: 0

    Ability: Limit. Ransom. Choose one pirate crew at setup. This crew is linked to that crew. If that linked crew is eliminated or removed from the game, replace this crew’s ability and point cost with the linked crew’s.

    Flavor text: Anne Dieu-le-Veut never imagined herself going on the account, until she fell in love with a dashing pirate captain. While for now she stays in the shadows, her sharp eye watches her husband’s actions closely. She knows if the worst were to happen to him, that she would be able to fill his shoes.

    Jacquotte Delahaye

    Type: Crew

    Nation: Pirates

    Cost: 7

    Ability: Marine. At the end of one of your turns, if this crew* is on a wild island, you may remove this crew from the game, place a pirate fort on this island. You do not need to have a ship docked at this island in order to build the fort. Follow all other fort building rules.

    Flavor text: Many people insist that the pirate base this Haitian woman is supposed to lead does not exist. Those who know better know that Delahaye would sooner die than allow her paradise to fall.

    Conseil

    Type: Crew

    Nation: Mercenaries

    Cost: 4

    Ability: Ex-Patriot. Dories. This crew takes up no cargo space.

    Flavor text: Once an aide to famed French biologist Pierre Arronax, Conseil found a new calling when Captain Nemo took note of his exceptional organizational skills, and put him to work making sure his submarines operated at their full potential.

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 2 weeks ago by Jack.
    #11964
    Xerecs
    Moderator

    What ship does Conseil link to? Dories kind of requires a link to function.

    Delahaye’s ability  is intriguing, but doesn’t seem to make sense. How can the ship be on an island without being docked at it? I’m assuming that you meant when this CREW as opposed to this SHIP?

    #11965
    Ben
    Keymaster

    @Jack: Have you seen my versions of Anne and Delahaye in Epic Seas?

    #11966
    Jack
    Participant

    Whoops, meant crew, not ship, for Delahaye.

    The way I imagine Conseil working is that he encourages you to use the other named Mercenaries and their linked ships. So for example you put Conseil and Nikos Chelios on the Fathom.

    Surprised Anne Dieu-le-Veut and Delahaye have already been done lol thought those were pretty deep cuts in pirate history.

    #11968
    Xerecs
    Moderator

    The way I imagine Conseil working is that he encourages you to use the other named Mercenaries and their linked ships. So for example you put Conseil and Nikos Chelios on the Fathom.

     

    From the Master Keyword list:

    Dories
    When her linked crew is aboard, this ship can unload cargo at your home island if she’s within S of it.

     

    This could devolve into a hypothetical rules discussion, but I believe this means that in order for Dories to work there has to be a link between whatever has the keyword. The Shui-Xian for example links to the Tsai, and has the Dories keyword, so if you put Tsai on the Xian, the Xian can unload cargo at a home island within S.

    I don’t think you can put Dories on a crew and use it for another crew on the same ship, regardless of any links. Granted, I could be wrong.

    #11970
    Ben
    Keymaster

    I don’t think you can put Dories on a crew and use it for another crew on the same ship, regardless of any links.

    Looks like the opposite to me – the keyword doesn’t say the game piece with the keyword has to have the link.  As long as the ship’s linked crew is aboard, that should trigger the ability to work.  We just didn’t see Dories on a crew from Wizkids.

    #11987
    Mr. Wick
    Participant

    The first three cogs are finished (just without flavor text), take a look.

    Madre de Deus

    Type: Ship

    Faction: Portuguese

    Point Cost: 6

    Masts: 1

    Cargo: 6

    Base Move: S

    Cannons: 5S

    Ability: Cog. Secret Hold.

     

    Santa Catarina

    Type: Ship

    Faction: Portuguese

    Point Cost: 6

    Masts: 1

    Cargo: 5

    Base Move: S+S

    Cannons: 4S

    Ability: Cog. Parley.

     

    Sao Jao y Felix

    Type: Ship

    Faction: Portuguese

    Point Cost: 6

    Masts: 1

    Cargo: 4

    Base Move: L

    Cannons: 3S

    Ability: Cog. After looking at treasure on a wild island, you may trade any one treasure from that island for a random treasure on any other wild island. This ship must load the traded treasure.

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 2 weeks ago by Mr. Wick.
    #11989
    Xerecs
    Moderator

    These look a bit under-priced….. Does Cog have any serious negative abilities to warrant such low point costs?

    To be fair, I’m guilty of undervaluing cargo as well, but anytime you get as much cargo as the ship costs, or more, that ship is going to be very good.

    #11990
    Mr. Wick
    Participant

    I’m just going on a formula I’ve seen a pattern for in which most basal 1 masted ships are roughly 3pts, +X for their model bonus, +/-X for their abilities. If you feel these ships should be priced higher what point cost would you put them at?

    #11991
    Ben
    Keymaster

    @Mr. Wick: Whenever posting customs using custom keywords (or even unofficial abbreviations of Wizkids abilities), I recommend posting the keyword text so people don’t have to search for it.

    In general I agree with Xerecs that they are probably a bit underpriced.  Cargo is quite valuable overall and should definitely factor into a ship’s point cost.  What is a “model bonus”?

    Here are the point costs I would recommend for playtesting: Madre de Deus and Santa Catarina at 8, Sao Jao y Felix at 7.  I reckon their fragility and lack of “extremespeed” will prevent them from needing to be in double digits.  Though I haven’t played with Cogs of course, and Wizkids never released a 1 master with more than 4 cargo spaces. (which I like)

    Looking forward to more! 🙂

    #11998
    Mr. Wick
    Participant

    Okay, thank you for the criticism, what I meant by “model bonus” was a generic increase in point cost based on a ship model type (i.e. Turtle Ship, Long Ship, etc). I was finding that “ship type” abilities were increasing the base 1 master cost by 2-3 or more but that sloops with negative effects would have an overall point cost of 2. Which led me to believe that a basic 1 masted ship with no ability text or ship type would cost roughly 3 points. So I started there, added the +1 for the Cog ability and then added additional points for the value of abilities I granted the ships.

    Also thank you for letting me know to repost ability text later with future custom ships.

    #11999
    Ben
    Keymaster

    Which led me to believe that a basic 1 masted ship with no ability text or ship type would cost roughly 3 points. So I started there, added the +1 for the Cog ability and then added additional points for the value of abilities I granted the ships.

    I think the problem there is that speed and cargo are two of the most important attributes for any ship.  Size and abilities are part of what make up a vessel’s point cost, but there are a lot of factors.

    I would say that for 1 masters, the cannon is disproportionately not as much of a factor in the cost, since even if it’s a 2L, it’s not likely to be used much or to cause much damage even if it does get used.  (versus a 5 master with all 4S guns or all 2L’s – massive difference)

    #12000
    Mr. Wick
    Participant

    Ah that makes sense, I’ll take more consideration for a ships cargo/speed categories in pricing ships in the future.

    #12003
    Mr. Wick
    Participant

    Pardon my impertinence, but this is the current state of my first ship manifest (I haven’t added the other factions yet, but this is the Portuguese faction atm.

    Friendly reminders: Cog: Once per turn, a friendly ship within S can explore this ship as a free action (this occurs on the cogs turn), Caravel: This ship may perform a stern turn, this ship benefits from opposing trade currents as though they were friendly. Carrack: This ship cannot be rammed or pinned by 1 or 2 masted ships. This ship gets +1 to cannon rolls against 1 and 2 masted ships within S.

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Kb-5v9-agJ-VjZCELlppxdWeRo6Xig3s/edit#gid=1249952571

    #12004
    Woelf
    Moderator

    Conseil

    Type: Crew

    Nation: Mercenaries

    Cost: 4

    Ability: Ex-Patriot. Dories. This crew takes up no cargo space.

    The way WK defined the Dories keyword restricts where and how it can be used, so it should only be put on a ship that has at least one crew linked to it.

    If this was intended to be a Mercenary version of Bianco’s Haulers, which the point cost of 4 supports, you should write out (copy&paste) the ability just to avoid any confusion.

    #12012
    Ben
    Keymaster

    @All: If you had to pick just one, what is your absolute favorite custom ship you’ve made?

     

    I think Conseil makes enough sense as-is.  You just wouldn’t use it on ships that don’t have a proper link.

    @Mr. Wick: The spreadsheet is asking me to request access, so it looks like you need to make the link publicly available for everyone to see in order to share it properly.

    #12014
    Jack
    Participant

    Alternatively, if I had Conseil link to all mercenary ships instead of taking up cargo space, would that work? ? Probably not.

    The intent behind me putting dories on it besides just simply making him have the Bianco’s Hauler’s ability was to reward people for making “lore correct” combinations, and provide more incentive for players to make use of ExPats’ +1 roll on mysterious islands if they’re on their linked ship. I also wanted something of a nerf, as an ExPat that could let you unload within S and takes up no cargo space would probably get splashed into a hole bunch of ships.

    Makes sense to me, but if I were to make actual copies of these I might just change it to be word for word Bianco’s Haulers just to avoid potential confusion.

    #12015
    Xerecs
    Moderator

    Ooh, favorite custom I’ve made….. That’s a tough one, especially if I have to choose just ONE.

    For now…… I’m going to say the Carnage.

    You can find her in the LE section of Return of Davy Jones in the Customs Database, but I’ll list her here.

     

    Hidden Gold: This ship has 2 additional cargo spaces that may only be taken with treasure.

     

    Carnage
    Pirate
    Points: 20
    Masts: 4
    Cannons: 3S-2L-2L-3S
    Cargo: 4
    Movement: S+S
    Ability: Hidden Gold. If this ship is assigned a captain crew, she gets +1 to her cannon and boarding rolls, and the Eternal keyword.

    Link: One-Handed John

    Flavor: The red sails of the Carnage bring fear to all who sails the seas, for they know that to cross the Carnage and Captain John is to bring about their own doom. Even the Cursed souls of the sea stay away from this ship.

    #12016
    Mr. Wick
    Participant

    woops! sorry about that I got it changed.

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Kb-5v9-agJ-VjZCELlppxdWeRo6Xig3s/edit#gid=1249952571

    Any criticism is fine.

    If I had to pick a favorite I don’t think I could, but I like Joao Vaz, it’s fast and it has S-Explore.

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Mr. Wick.
    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Mr. Wick.
    #12028
    Ben
    Keymaster

    @Mr. Wick: Neat custom set! 😀 Looking at point costs, here are some changes I’d recommend:
    Madeira: 4 (considerably worse than the Coral from RV)
    Arguim: 4
    Ano-Bom: 4
    La Pinta: 18 (looks like one of the best ships in the set!)
    Santa Clara: 14
    Cabo da Tormentas: 8 (no cargo is a massive negative)
    Sao Filipe: 18 (absolute powerhouse of a hybrid, looks extremely effective! 🙂 )
    Sao Marcos: 10
    Sao Martinho could come down to 20-22 points in games under 100 points build total. Though I do like the higher cost for campaign games.
    Native Canoes: 11-12 (canoes with more than 1 cargo each are extremely good)
    Guzmán: 9
    Vasco da Gama: 4
    Afonso de Albuquerque: 8

    Sao Luis is a tough one to judge and a very interesting ship.
    Goncalo Nunes is quite interesting. Is his final ability meant to only apply when NOT docked at his home island? (ex: from the Shipwright ability)
    I like the touch of having a 0 coin on the oarsman card. 🙂
    Any reason you put the 5 masters at the bottom of the ship section?
    I would also delete the # signs from the non-linked pieces.
    I see you took some liberties with the historical side of things, given that Alonso Pérez de Guzmán was from Spain. (him and the San Martin are LE’s for the Spanish in my Age of Sail set)

    Would you like to have your own tab for the set in the Customs Database?

    #12029
    Mr. Wick
    Participant

    Goncalo Nunes’s last ability is in fact meant to be used off-island

    The Ships were arranged by quantity of masts primarily so I could decide how many ships of each mast they would get.

    I did take a small number of liberties. The creation of the San Martinho occurred very shortly before King Philip II became king of Portugal so the ship was built for the Portuguese navy in 1580 but was commanded by the Duke of Medina Sidonia (then Alonso Perez de Guzman) as part of the Spanish/Portuguese “Invincible” Armada. As a significant Portuguese vessel I felt it made sense to make it’s commander Portuguese rather than Spanish.

    If you find my ships interesting enough to playtest I’d be honored to have a tab in the custom database. I intend to create more after this (I kind of want to dabble with druas and a Tonga/Srivijaya/Majapahit faction)

    Do you feel any of the ships/crew are under/overpowered?

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Mr. Wick.
    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Mr. Wick.
    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Mr. Wick.
    #12033
    Ben
    Keymaster

    Goncalo Nunes’s last ability is in fact meant to be used off-island

    I would make that more clear then, to make it so that ability can’t be used when the ship is repairing without the need of a shipwright (such as at the home island or a friendly fort).  If it’s meant to be used only at sea, that would have to be specified to avoid being able to use it at random wild islands.

    Do you feel any of the ships/crew are under/overpowered?

    Not if the point costs are adjusted a bit, as noted above.  Without making the changes, Madeira is underpowered and La Pinta might be OP, but most of them are okay.  Since I prefer not to recommend changing a creator’s ideas (sometimes it’s necessary of course, when things are absurdly OP), I like to simply adjust point costs.  It’s not always enough of a fix for some of the crazy stuff like I’ve made, but if something feels too good, I just increase the cost. (and if it’s still OP after that, changes can be made to things other than point cost)

    #12035
    Woelf
    Moderator

    Alternatively, if I had Conseil link to all mercenary ships instead of taking up cargo space, would that work? ? Probably not.

    The intent behind me putting dories on it besides just simply making him have the Bianco’s Hauler’s ability was to reward people for making “lore correct” combinations, and provide more incentive for players to make use of ExPats’ +1 roll on mysterious islands if they’re on their linked ship. I also wanted something of a nerf, as an ExPat that could let you unload within S and takes up no cargo space would probably get splashed into a hole bunch of ships.

    @Jack – That would probably work.   Leaving it exactly how you had it written initially would technically work too, it’s just an awkward way to apply it because of how WK worded the ability.   You’d get the ability from Conseil as long as the ship had at least one other crew linked with it, making him kind of a third wheel on the lore connection.

    #12090
    Ben
    Keymaster

    Wordpress and postimages couldn’t handle the massive image files, but imgur allowed me to repost Custom Ships Organized Version as it appeared at Miniature Trading. 🙂  (except for the text being a little harder to read)

    #12139
    Robert Foster
    Participant

    Now this Set is not complete but I would like input so far, keep in mind I based them off the meanings of the Major Arcana in a Tarot Deck.

     

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1SP_fY9hN0hb3b_xNOC8z2BTlnErtcXwa-IRPnjbzhY4/edit?usp=sharing

    #12140
    Xerecs
    Moderator

    Sounds like a cool concept, even though I have no familiarity with the Major Arcana or tarot cards.

    Your link denied me access. If you want to keep the doc as private until the set is complete, then I recommend you post the ships and crew individually here on the forum.

    Alternatively you could create a viewable link for your doc.

    #12141
    Robert Foster
    Participant
    #12143
    Xerecs
    Moderator

    Yes, I can see the doc now.

    Interesting to see the Super Rare and Promos listed first. I’ll get to standout ships and crew, but for now what strikes me is that you’ve made what looks like 5 new factions. Also, why does almost every ship have Treasure Ship?

    #12145
    Robert Foster
    Participant

    Quickest way to type “This Ship Requires it’s linked crew.”

    Also they are listed that way due to how the Major Arcana are placed in order (0-XXI)

    For reference these are the Major Tarot https://www.biddytarot.com/tarot-card-meanings/major-arcana/

    #12147
    Xerecs
    Moderator

    Is that all you want from the keyword, or do you want the rest of it applied to each ship? Crew not taking up cargo space, being able to move S after loading or unloading treasure?

     

    May I suggest a new keyword if you’re looking to fast-track the process.

    Linked: This ship must begin the game with her linked crew assigned to her.

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